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[Fwd: Re: Maybe why Avante-garde looping in US...]

> With rare exception, hip hop vocal rhythms are all subdivisions of 
4/4 phrasing...
> I would not put them in the same category of rhythmic complexity as 
music where the bars constantly change beat length (4/4, 3/ 4, 7/8, 5/8,
2/4, 12/8etc.).  I would not consider improvising over a solid 4/4 beat,
where the "one" is rarely in question to be particularly sophisticated
(opinion alert).

Well, I've played Balkan and I humbly disagree altho your mileage may 
In Balkan the bars don't always constantly change meter, they're usually 
in a
standard odd meter that continues thoughout the tune.  Think of Ivo 
Papasov as
an example--yes he's a pop star but pop stars are what most people listen 
Once you're in the odd meter you don't really venture out of it--you have
neither syncopation nor polyrhythm in the stuff I've played.  YMMV, of 
 In hiphop polyrhythm is often used, together with push-pull of the beat 
syncopation of the most amazing kind.  There is a lot of improv in hiphop 
some of the rhymes have obviously been very carefully composed.

The European tradition gave harmonic sophistication to the world.  The 
and South Asian traditions gave rhythmic sophistication to the world.  All
three gave very strong melodic sophistication, of course.