loops, ambient or otherwise

[Reginald Hunt <rphunt@tiac.net>]

The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points:

Music and Artistically Valid Noise

Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or they
are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of production is
irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted,
Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final sonic
result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic results 
are
meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of 
course,
approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice.

By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also to
the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by
situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a band/orchestra
in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the
technology/technique, I bring up the next point....

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My operating definition of "looping" has been this:

Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time
segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments 
must
be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs.  

A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over
manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not
looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of the
three. Which is why I bring up the next point....

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The purpose of looping to me appears to be:

To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily.

To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other economically
feasable way.

To create a One-Man-Band.

Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of those
categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political,
psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to these.
However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately
suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after 
experience. 

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Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow
sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its 
contingent
of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not
intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself
to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of
awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient
music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for 
that.

Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond
music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship,
and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at
performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been
about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere
asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and
observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist.

Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a method,
not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us.

Reg


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From: "Liebig, Steuart A." <LiebigSA@Maritz.com>
To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID:
<"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret>
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Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800

Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the
live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the
canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes
intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is
looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . .
. I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and
I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor
in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally
pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.)


> ----------
> From:         Kim Flint
> Reply To:     Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
> Sent:         Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM
> To:   LiebigSA@maritz.com
> Subject:      Re: location & Loopers' CD
> 
> At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote:
> >
> 
> >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; 
> 
> I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest
> motivation
> for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together!
> Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply!
> 
> 
> (pun intended there....)
> 
> 
> >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" 
> >instrumental music.  
> 
> I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician.
> What
> others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I
> resolutely
> refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply
> offended
> by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm
> proud of
> my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to
> overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless
> idol
> worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! 
> 
> of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those
> maniacs
> are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San
> Francisco.
> The apocalypse will arrive none too soon.
> 
> this, of course, gets many smiley's:  :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)
> 
> 
> >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or 
> >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music 
> >can you let me know? 
> 
> that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's
> in a
> bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla
> sound
> card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1.
> 
> kim
> _______________________________________________________
> Kim Flint                     408-752-9284
> Mpact Systems Engineering     kflint@chromatic.com
> Chromatic Research            http://www.chromatic.com
> 
>