Re: P2 Quandaries! (was: Fripp Nerves)

[Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle)]

>> Are there any of you out there who actually prefer looser "open" 
>jamming and 
>> minimal imposed structure?

>Well, I don't know that it's a matter of preference past how one feels at 
>a
>given moment or series of moments, actually.  

Given... Depending on mood I swing between wanting to play structured 
pieces and
open form pieces. Lately my mood has been very zen and open... wanting the 
dialog to develop in real time. My responses may be contrived or certainly 
informed by my technique and preference as well, but at least the idea has 
sprung from impulse rather than pre-meditation. An ongoing quandry for me 
is how
to incorporate more structure without "canning" the experience.

>I think most of the ways in which we address allegedly non-structured 
>content 
>may have a lot more to do with our expectations of that content, than the 
>content itself.

I'm certain that on any given night there will be expectations. As to how 
the 
music fares in relation to them is anyone's guess. 

It's sad when you've been waiting to record with someone for a year and 
the 
anticipation creates too much expectation. It's great when you just walk 
in and 
surprise each other though. (especially when it's verified upon playback!)

>* Those who expected something from the music that didn't happen (flaming
>Frippian solos, KC material from the 70's, ad nauseam) were very, very
>disappointed,...

It was actually quite funny to hear prog dinosaurs griping about how 
shitty the 
show was and how dissappointed they were with Fripp! I guess I should have 
expected it...

>* Those who went Without Expectations, and withheld judgement until they'd
>heard entire works, were far, far less disappointed,...

Oh yeah...

>but in general tended to discuss the material a lot less than the angry 
>ones 
>did.

Not sure about this but I definitely heard a lot of griping! My friends 
(who 
also quite enjoyed the show) and I talked a lot about it...

>And, I didn't feel ripped off in any way.  I laughed at the execution of
>THRAK in that manner, in a good way...

It was GREAT to see Fripp and co. really laughing and enjoying the show. I 
particularly enjoyed seeing Robert jump up and encourage audience response 
to 
Belew's drum solo with much arm waving and gesturing... Quite funny and 
charming.

>So, does improvisational work - either participating or listening to it -
>say more about us, or about our feelings about it?

Not sure... This reminds me of a previous poster recalling someone asking 
if a 
Fripp piece was played by a keyboardist, would you still listen to it? 
It's a 
very interesting question...

My knowledge that someone is "walking the wire" and improvising certainly 
affects my response to the music. It's more performance related than media 
related. 

On fixed media you lose the context of the improv and it's often 
impossible to 
relate all the elements which supported the improv and it's direction. 
Improv 
performance is more about the wiles of the performer and their responses 
and 
references etc. It's like surfing or skiing for me... a real time reaction 
to 
multiple stimuli... call and response... wit... rejoinder... parry... 
flow... 
gravity... vision... The phrase "You had to be there." could certainly 
apply.

That said, it's "still just sound" as Andre LaFosse says and ultimately 
has to 
sit alongside work that may be far more mature and complete 
compositionally and 
in terms of production values. If an improv still elicits a strong 
response in 
that environment I give it double extra credit! 8->

Thanks Stephen...

best,
-Miko