Re: dt harmony-central repeater review

[Mark Sottilaro <sine@zerocrossing.net>]

Sorry Kim!  I thought I was defending you ("Conflict of interest...I don't 
see
it.")  I'm not angry, about the Repeater Review, you seemed angry that 
people had
done them for Harmony Central, and not LD.  I forget not everyone is a 
slacker
like me!  There's no way I could keep a site like LD going!  It seemed 
like you
were anxious to get one, and I just thought you didn't think my review was 
deep
enough.  I admit, as a guitarist/synth guitarist, I don't really use the 
Repeater
for it's remix/DJ capabilities (most of what it seems to be designed for, 
but
more on that in a second post...).  I would imagine someone who did a bit 
of both
with the Repeater would have a more complete review.  Anyway, no ego here, 
I
really just thought my review was not all that comprehensive.  I never 
have even
tried to get something to synch to it's midi clock.  I'm glad you liked it
though, and post it away, whenever.

Man, I totally appreciate LD and the amazing labor of love that it is.  I 
don't
think there's a day that goes by that I don't start a conversation with my 
wife
that starts, "Oh there's this thread on the LD list..."  She's actually 
thinking
of joining in on the fun!  So is my friend Dan, who I just spent the day 
with,
going over the ins and outs of loop based music.

So keep on keeping on Kim.  If I were you, I'd review away and post it.  
Start
with a disclaimer explaining what you do and who you are.  I found your 
list
posts about the
Repeater to be EXTREMELY helpful.  Who better to review such a device than
someone who's been in the belly of the beast!  Frankly, I think by 
pointing out
serious flaws you most definitely helped Electrix.  Moderator posts on 
their
Repeater forum talk of correcting the flaws you brought up.  Maybe 
Electrix will
chip in for your site!  They should!

Mark Sottilaro



Kim Flint wrote:

> At 10:17 AM 9/22/2001, Mark Sottilaro wrote:
> >  Kim did not decide to publish my review, and
> >that's fine, he's the editor... he's also the man who writes/wrote the
> >software for the EDP.  Conflict of interest?  There's the possibility 
>of it,
> >but I don't see it.
>
> hold on, what? I never made any such decision! I have several Repeater
> reviews that I have received for the web site, including yours Mark. Some
> are positive, some negative, some balanced. In fact, I thought yours was
> probably the best I've received. I just don't have time in my life right
> now to be updating web sites every day, so I have to wait until I do have
> that time to put it together. Please don't take that as meaning I decided
> not to use something! They will all get up there eventually, with the
> possible exception of the other review I mentioned where I have some 
>issues
> with it. I also frequently ask people questions about their reviews to 
>give
> them an opportunity to revise it and make it as complete as possible. I 
>do
> this because I hope to make the reviews on Looper's Delight as useful to
> the looping community as possible.
>
> And I definitely recognize my own conflicts of interest in this. That is
> why you won't see any reviews of mine published on the LD web site,
> although I do sometimes make comments on the list. I assume that 
>comments I
> make on the list can be easily challenged or addressed by anybody who 
>wants
> to do that. And indeed, that happens. That is one reason why I don't
> moderate anything here.  I've also never withheld anything from 
>publishing
> on the site because of any interests of opinions of mine. I try to keep
> these things as separate as I am able to. Indeed, the biggest conflict I
> have is my time, in weighing the time I spend on LD vs. my current job 
>at a
> really intense startup vs. work for Aurisis and the Echoplex vs. my own
> personal life. The only thing that actually makes me any money out of 
>those
> four is my job, so that's where most of the time goes. :-)
>
> It goes deeper than just my background of involvement in the EDP, as I do
> receive money for advertising on Looper's Delight from a variety of
> companies whose products are discussed here. Since I've been actively
> seeking such revenues in the past six months or so as a means to pay the
> growing costs of the site, the amounts have been getting larger. (Not 
>very
> much though. :-( I still lose quite a bit of money on all of this.) So I
> have conflicts of interest there as well, where I need to try to maintain
> integrity and honesty of the site while receiving wildly varying amounts 
>of
> money from various companies represented there. I desperately need that
> income to pay for things, so I frequently find myself questioning my own
> actions and whether they are influenced by money promised or received, or
> likewise, whether they might threaten future income that I need. My
> approach so far has been to continue being myself, because I think 
>anything
> else is dishonest. I also think that the site is only interesting to 
>people
> in the world so long as it is honest and informative, and that 
>maintaining
> that will keep people coming, which will then attract more advertising
> money to pay for it. I think people can see through bullshit pretty 
>easily,
> so I don't try to give them any. But I do continue asking myself these
> questions, and you can feel free to do the same. I would rather put
> everything out there for people to make their own judgements.
>
> In the case of the Repeater, I actually own two of them, so I'm probably
> more invested in Electrix and the Repeater than most people here. So if 
>I'm
> an owner and a user of something, I guess I think I should get to speak 
>my
> opinions of it same as anybody else. In fact, I think the cost of those
> Repeaters is greater than any money I've ever personally earned from LD 
>or
> the EDP. (both of which are things I've spent far more on than I've ever
> earned.)  so where does that leave me? :-)
>
> oh, BTW, it is Matthias who mainly writes the Echoplex software, and
> occasionally Eric. I don't do software, just hardware and business stuff.
>
> >I was able to duplicate the problems that Kim found
> >easily.  Was he a bit emotional about the Repeater's problems?  Sure, 
>but the
> >EDPs throne is being challenged for it's first time.  The EDP is his 
>baby, so
> >of course he'll be emotional, but at least he was accurate.
>
> That is probably a truthful assessment, although the EDP has been getting
> challenged for years for some reason or another. I did have a whole post 
>of
> good things to say about the repeater too:
> http://www.loopers-delight.com/LDarchive/200109/msg00353.html
>
> I basically like the repeater, and think it's a great product, although
> with some flaws. But I do think the looping market is really confused 
>about
> what the Repeater is all about. To me that is the main source of
> frustration. After using them both, I find the Repeater and EDP don't 
>have
> very much in common, so I don't really see them as much in competition. 
>It
> is only in a confused market that they compete.
>
> Some people seem to have convinced themselves that the Repeater is the 
>same
> type of device as the echoplex or jamman or dl-4, etc., and bought it for
> those reasons or as a replacement for those things. They want it to be an
> echoplex/jamman performance-oriented looper with new features added.
> Repeater isn't like that, and when they try to use it that way they get
> very frustrated and have some really negative reactions. People who grok
> Repeater as more of a recording or remix tool based in looping principles
> seem to like it (and don't seem to understand where the negative 
>reactions
> come from). Likewise, people who never understood that the echoplex was
> entirely designed as a live performance instrument and instead tried to 
>use
> it as a recording tool have often been frustrated by it as well.
>
> In the current case, I think Electrix could probably do a better job of
> setting people's expectations for what the Repeater is all about. So far
> they have had a tendency to promise everything to everybody, which they
> obviously can't deliver on. And they haven't done anything to stop people
> thinking it would be the ultra-jamman or something like that. Leaving the
> market confused probably results in better sales in the short term, but
> some of those buyers are going to be unhappy and that comes back to hurt
> Electrix. In the long term I think it is better if everybody who buys the
> Repeater understands it to begin with, and then gets what they thought 
>they
> were getting.
>
> kim
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> Kim Flint                     | Looper's Delight
> kflint@loopers-delight.com    | http://www.loopers-delight.com