Re: How do you approach looping composition?

["max valentino" <ekstasis1@hotmail.com>]

Thank you, Scott, for the very nice compliment!

In regards to composition with loops, one must consider just what you 
want/need to do with the loop, when and how.
I have been giving all of this a lot of attention lately in my own work.  
For me, the challenge has been to make the "loopage" more interactive with 
the real time playing.

One very cool aspect of the LD list,is the interchange bewteen players.  
It 
seems all of us use different approaches to 
looping/performance/composition, 
of which the techniques, tips and tricks we are all quite welcome, even 
eager, to share with others.  This allows for a great deal of mutual 
influences and cross-pollination, so to speak.

I have noticed a few things about we loopists and how we work.
There are some of us who pile up fx and processing before the loop and 
make 
each "layer" have it's own sonic signature, allowing it to standout from 
the 
other layers.  In this aspect, it is much like multi-track recording, and 
is 
very much an additive approach in which our "box" is contiually being 
filled 
until it can simply hold no more.   Perhaps, Christian, this is one 
dilemma 
you have encountered with your own looping.  Of course, the only remedy to 
this is to know when to stop adding to the loop.
At thast point it may be creative to begin subtracting from the loop, 
peeling away layers before constructing new ones.

There are also some on this list who prefer to process, or "treat" the 
loops 
themselves; often referred to here as "mangling".  In some ways this helps 
to alieviate the "filling up the box" syndrome, as with this technique the 
loopist needs to pay attention to what has already been recorded, and how 
that is been effected by any treatments. For instrance, running a loop 
thru 
a filter device can drastically change the sonic foundation and "flow" of 
a 
piece, taking it along an entirely new tangent.  This approach can seem to 
subtractive, as the player is, at times, filtering out bits of sound, or, 
at 
very least, "evolving", mutating, or re-constructing an recorded (and 
looped) event.

Of course, there are those who do both of the above.  Again, the key to a 
well-looped performance is knowing when to stop adding to a loop, when to 
treat, or stop treating, when to "undo"..etc.
And, that just comes with hours and hours of practice, and paying 
attention 
to oine's own creative flow.

In both cases here, there is a tendancy to create a loop and let it run, 
with all the varied, "added" parts, for the length of a piece.  For my own 
compositons, of late, I have been working with loops which    I "fly" in 
and 
out of a piece, adding color and texture, rather than being a static event 
which I add to or play over.  Having the ability to run multiple loops in 
parallel means I can fade in and out short loops to add color/contrast, 
density, accompaniment, and texture to a solo bass piece.  I can "remove" 
them from the piece, and yet bring them back at a different point in the 
performance to provide a sense of continuity.  This makes the "loop" 
interactive with my own playing, and hopefully, when done right, it is 
seamless enough to not stand out from the rest of the "played" performance 
( 
in what the audience may percieve as "canned").

Again, this is considering how you use a loop, as well as when, and where 
the loop is used. Recording a loop, rhythmic or harmonic, layering a buch 
of 
stuff over it, and playing over that, while being the "direction" many of 
us 
started taking when we first entered into looping, hardly makes use of the 
potential of "live-looping" (yet again, it is one approach which is 
certainly viable....if only a "one-dimensional" approach, and again, 
knowing 
when to stop adding to the loop will make it more "musical", knowing when 
to 
peel away layers of the loop could help make this approach more 
two-dimensional).

Then there is the LaFosse-school, where the players actually "plays" the 
loop.  Andre actually eschews any fx processing in his gtr-EDP-amp signal 
chain, but his ability to "play" the EDP, carving up , slicing and dicing, 
his gtr loops, creates something totally unique and wonderful, and is a 
rather original way of "composing" with loops.

Although I do not use an EDP, Andre's work, and his techniques of working 
with a loop (rather than merely to it), has had a tremedous influence on 
my 
own concepts of "composing" with loops.
  This "interactive-ness" allows the tool (looping device) to become an 
instrument in its' own right, and leads to countless possibilities of 
re-structuring both sound and the form of a composition.


Max



>From: Scott Kungha Drengsen >
>Hello Christian,
>My 1st Cd "Bassapes" was pretty much layering and reverse on a 
>Boomerang.(This was before I discovered this list the Echoplex and the 
>work 
>of Daved Torn and Jeff Pearce).I think that Steve Lawson and Max 
>Valentino 
>are bassists who are masters of this approach.
>>
>cristian cascetta wrote:
>
>>Hello,
>>
>>It's my first post (even if I registered to the mailing list 5 months 
>>ago), so I'd like to introduce myself:
>>

>>
>>How do you approach looping composition? I'd like to create some 
>>composition and a little repertoire, as I'd like to try some bass 
>looping 
>>busking.
>>
>>When I try to compose something, I start with some simple riff, then I 
>add 
>>some layer, but soon I've the impression of overplaying and messing up 
>>everything.
>>
>>I think that I'm focusing too much on the looping paradigm, and I lose 
>the 
>>musical inspiration. Another disturbing thing is that I tend to answer 
>and 
>>react to the loops I create filling every silent part producing a strong 
>>anxiety impression in what I play.
>>
>>I know composing is a very personal matter, but I hope to get some 
>>suggestions from you experienced loopers.
>>
>>cristian

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