Re: Static Loops, Quantized Sequences and Music that Breathes

["Arne R. Skage jr" <arneskage@gmail.com>]

Dynamics is what make sounds into music, as you have dynamics in pitch and level you also have dynamics in tempo, In my opinion some of the best music are made when musicians lock intuitivly to each others playing , then variations become part of the common pallette that makes the sum bigger than parts of the group ,  to be tight or loose just for the sake of it doesnt make good or bad music, but if the musicians are good and know eatch other well varying degrees of "tightness"  are part of the common toolbox....

 

dont know if you guys know or like the Neville brothers ( new orleans) - but i read an interview with Art Neville  years back where he discussed why their debut album sucket; he said something about the producer forced them to record to a clicktrack to get the timing "right" , this Neville said screwed up the timing dynamics interaction that was made their music funky , the producer replaced the heartbeat with a electronic pulse........ you might disagree, but i know what i prefer

 

A

 

2007/8/16, Per Boysen <perboysen@gmail.com>:

What a great feedback from Andy on Rick's post! I just have to quote
it all below because it's so right on! I'd like to chime in and say
that I really liked it the first time I heard drummer Charlie Watts
playing at a slightly different tempo then Brian Jones and the boys
in the band. It felt awesome in an almost creepy way to hear two
different tempi instantly clashing. The coolest thing is that Charlie
Watts doesn't immediately change his tempo in this situation, but
keeps on bashing the drums at the "wrong" tempo while slowly
adjusting to go into playing a little "too fast" for a while until he
catches up and the entire band once again glues together into the
usual rock 'n roll machine.

For some years during the eighties I played guitar in a row of reggae
bands and this was an awesomely educating  experience in rhythm. As
usual I was deported to playing "ornamentation lead guitar" rather
freely, but my biggest kick was to listen to, and learn from, the
rhythm guitarist. This guy could really drift around the "tempo root"
in a beautiful way. He just played "chop!  ---  (long silence) ----
chop!" etc. He had that fine Charlie Watts kind of sense for placing
free floating tempo around the tempo root, rather than being obsessed
by "playing tight" (ouch... I've had terrible experiences trying to
cooperate with people that see music as "tight" vs "wrong"). Another
funny thing I noticed is that whenever he smoked grass he completely
lost this his delicate sense of timing (although himself, he thought
he was playing great then ;-)

I also like it in programmed synth based techno music when you twist
knobs on the synths while they play sequenced stuff, so the attack of
a synth sound might become slower, thus causing this entire musical
section to slowly drift into a gradually slower tempo as the synth
sound attack becomes slower and slower (this happening while other
synth sequences keep playing at the original tempo). I experienced
this phenomenon when starting to work with MIDI sequencing in the
late eighties but not until hearing Alex Paterssons superb sequencing
on the Orb's first release (The Ever Pulsating Brain In The Center Of
The Universe... or whatever the title was) I finally understood that
this is actually the same musical phenomenon as when Charlie Watts
plays drums... or Ry Coder guitar, to mention another of my old
"elastic tempo interpretation" heroes.

This thing with "elastic tempo", as in multiple drifting tempi, is
also the reason for my big crush on the OS X modular sequencing
application Numerology. I think I'll stop here before the Off Topic
Intelligence guys come to bring me in...

per



>> At the same time,  rigidity is the first inherent problem of
>> trying to learn how to play to
>> clicks.

On 16 aug 2007, at 10.13, andy butler wrote:

> I agree with Rick that it's possible to add life to rigid tempos,
> and indeed, that's a very relevant point for looping.
>
> ..but
>
> I think there's that magic moment when two or more
> players find a "clock" between them.
> I wouldn't care if the music staggered a bit on the way to finding
> that.
> Doesn't happen often(most players seem to have their own clock
> which they like to adhere to.)
> ..and never happens with a click
>
>> are
>> xenophobic when it comes to the concept.
>> If you can't find the exercises,   I'll repost them.  Just let me
>> know if you are interested
>
> well, I already got those from Rick,
> but always good to see them again :-)
>
> My finding was that, when drumming, it does indeed sound bad when
> you put in a jump in the timing to compensate for drift, makes the
> drummer sound bad even if someone else was doing the drifting.
> Mind you, if the timing is drifting anyway then you've got someone
> on the team who just isn't really listening, so that's the root
> problem, rather than the drummer.
> As a bass player, it's much easier to follow a drummers "mistakes"
> directly and play a supporting role rather than a prescriptive one.
> My technique for doing that would be make sure I wasn't counting
> time in my head, or tapping my foot, and listen to the drummer to
> understand their internal clock, without a notion that they are
> just "out of time". (then once the drummer starts to feel that
> support the rhythm starts to really flow)
>
> andy butler

-- 
Arne R. Skage jr.

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