Re: Expression vs Vol pedal for midi control

["Krispen Hartung" <khartung@cableone.net>]

I am no expert, but Jeff Kaiser, who has done some research on this with 
max/msp, says that any volume pedal will work, because it is just inducing 
an amplitude change.  Any devise that introduces an amplitude change can 
be 
used with max/msp. You have to add a cycle object in the pedal loop, which 
generates a sine wave...the pedal then decreases or increases the gain of 
that sine wave, because it is inserted in the loop of the sine wave.  The 
output of that is then converted to gain values, like -9.0db to -.5db, and 
then I add a conversation object in max that converts the -9.0 to -.5db 
range to 0 to 127.  I'm set, and I can do anything with that. I pull the 
EV-5 back, and the values in max go to 0. Push it all the way down it goes 
to 127. Then I map that 0-127 to any parameter in max. If I have a pitch 
shifter, and I want to go from -24 to +24 pitch, I simply tell max (with 
another small object) to convert that 0-127 range to -24 to +24. It's all 
just number manipulation and conversation once you get in max. It's cool, 
but I can do all this with no MIDI. I could even use an expression pedal 
to 
turn programs on and off...no MIDI.   I can do it all with amplitude 
changes. Jeff Kaiser uses no MIDI. He uses EV-5s for expression changes, 
plugging them directly into his audio interface, and he uses footswitches 
to 
turn programs on and off, also plugged into the audio interface...all with 
amplitude changes. With the switch, you just tell max that if the 
amplitude 
is under a certain value, to turn it off, if it is over, turn it on. 
Simple. 
No MIDI.  Cripes, I could plug my guitar into the FW400 and control 
parameters, turn things on and off, etc.  I could program max to turn 
effects on and off, only when I play certain frequencies on the guitar.

However, most of these devices (as you pointed out earlier) won't  map the 
voltage on a linear scale. But if you find a volume pedal that can switch 
from linear to log, then it would work out of the box.

I could still use a normal volume pedal for my system, connecting the 
output 
of the volume pedal to a FW400 input, and the FW400 output to the input of 
the volume pedal (no TSR required)....BUT I would have to add some extra 
code in my max patches to convert the log scale to linear...extra work, 
but 
doable.

Kris


Hi Kris,
Can you please clarify for me...
The EV-5 is generally considered to be an "expression pedal" and will work
in an exp.pedal input on hardware processors,  or exp.pedal input on a midi
controller  - correct?

Pedals like the Ernie Ball have inputs/outputs and are considered "volume
pedals". However, they will work as expression pedals when plugged into the
exp.pedal input of a hardware processor or midi controller when used with a
TRS-TSx2 Y cable.     ie. they will send CC 0-127 and can be calibrated
like an EV-5  - Correct?

In any case, I don't understand how an EV-5 (not a volume pedal) can be
used with the audio in/outs on a Fireface 400.

-Qua

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Krispen Hartung khartung@cableone.net
Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 13:23:09 -0700
To: Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com
Subject: Re: Expression Pedal - Alesis F2 Review


Thanks for all the othe pedal options. I am using the EV-5s  and I just ran
into a problem. Since the EV-5s already have a cord attached to them with a
stereo male end, I had to buy a few Hosa TSR adaptors. The problem is that
the adaptor wires are barely long enough to reach from the input and ouput
plugins of my Fireface 400 (yes, I am using them to control parameters in
max, rather than MIDI, which requires splitting the expression pedal inputs
and creating a loop between input/output of the audio interface.  They do
connect, but I'm worried about the tension. Hence, I am thinking of getting
two other pedals that don't have the cables already on them, but just the
jacks. Then I can just buy a TSR male to two mono quarter inch male patch
cord and not need any TSR Y-cables.
....,<snip>




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