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>And forget about putting anything other than guitar sounds >through it, the amp colors it too much. Umm... so why do people put up with this for guitar? I don't understand the amp obsession. Why not learn to love the sound of something other than the strange coloring traditional guitar amps provide? Is there really something inherently "good" about them, some deficiency in the tone of the guitar the amp makes up for, or such? Or are guitarists just used to how guitars sound on other people's records? What is wrong with Stanley Jordan's tone (I've never heard it)? Is it just not-what-you're-used-to? Would you complain if it was coming out of a DX-7? The music industry's obsession with recreating and refining "flawed-but-familiar" technology (an obsession shared throughout much of the worlds technology research) feels to me like an inevitable consequence of commerce: 1. decide on some new "different" sound to try to achieve pick a sound that people are familiar with, so you can market it 2. achieve it with varying degrees of success repeat those steps over and over So you have... cheesy analog synths (trying to imitate real sounds, very poorly) samplers (trying to imitate real sounds) new-fangled digital analog synths (trying to imitate the cheesy analogs) Now, note that at the third step, the goal is not to sound like the real sounds the cheesy analogs were a poor attempt at--it's to sound _just like_ those cheesy analogs. (They're not really cheesy, just trying to use technically precise language). Similarly you have the attempts to replicate the old analog roland drum machine, etc. etc. In the computer graphics world, a year or two ago I read several papers in a conference proceedings about software that would take a photograph and "turn it into" what looked like a watercolor painting of the same thing. This has all sorts of neat possibilities besides just using it to do same old thing--e.g. animated watercolors--but the odd thing is the amount of attention that goes into precisely replicating -unintentional artifacts- of the medium. Virtual brush strokes produce various sorts of splotches and drips, and the programs go to great lengths to reproduce these, so it will look "just like" the real thing. I understand the commerce motivation to sound/look "just like" the real thing, but I find the end result to be such a waste of energy--imagine if all that effort were to be put into creating new sounds/looks! [*] I guess the VG-8 attempts to balance this line--allowing precise emulation of all sorts of guitars and amps while also allowing new, never-before-heard things to be done to it... but in general the process bugs the heck out of me. Sean [*] I guess this leads to miserable sales a la Vortex