Re: Dummy Loads, Line Outs, and thangs like that

["Doug Cox" <bickleypunk@pdq.net>]

dt, Mark, Kim, Pedro, Chris, Stan, David, Greg, et. al.

THANKS!  That little bit of discussion and sharing of ideas has given me
some things to work on.  I think I'll try Greg's idea and use a long 
speaker
cable to put the Rivera cab in another room, and check sound of the 
Rivera's
line out into a JC-120.  I can confirm that the Rivera line out is *post*
power amp stage, so we'll see how it sounds.

I also hear a lot of votes for the THD Hotplate, and reactive loads in
general, so I'll go on a little hunt for one.  I think a friend of mine in
town has one (8 ohm, I hope!), so I'll give that a shot too.  I know it has
a dummy load setting, and an adjustable line out, so I'd hope for a good
tone from that into the JC-120s.

dt, thanks much for your detailed analysis and reply.  I still can't get
myself excited about using a mixer and aux sends, although I recognize the
extra flexibility it would add.  I think it's just my background as a 
guitar
player, and being a guy who wants to minimize the gear to lug around.  It's
also something to do with wanting to control most/all of my goodies with my
feet, as opposed to having to let go of the guitar to tweak a mixer
slider/knob.  Just forgive me, and let me suffer on that one! :)

Again guys, thanks.  I will report back on any/all experiments in this 
area.

Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: <Hedewa7@aol.com>
To: <Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com>
Sent: Friday, August 02, 2002 11:21 AM
Subject: Re: Dummy Loads, Line Outs, and thangs like that


> doug,
>
> >I know you have much experience with Rivera amps and racks of gear,
> well..... i use one rack w/4 single-space units in it.....
> i do use a rivera m100 head, quite often, which was modified by paul
rivera
> sr.
>
> >so
> >I
> >thought you'd be a good resource for this question.
> we'll see!
> 8-)
>
> >I have a Knucklehead 100 watt.  I also have a GR-1,
> gr-1 is a roland synth-gtr unit w/hex-pickup?
>
> >2 EDPs, and some other
> >stuff, that encourages me to run a stereo setup.
> right.
>
> >My current preference
> >is to run stereo into 2 JC-120s.  But...  I *love* the tone and
flexibility
> >of my Rivera, and am exploring ways to get it into my setup.
> gotcha.
>
> >My goal is to
> >treat the Knucklehead as the tone shaper of my guitar signal, while
keeping
> >my synth guitar and stereo capability.
> there is at least one alternate path --- if yer willing to haul 
>everything
> around:
> dual mono or 3-point stereo:
> gtr> knucklehead> dedicated knucklehead cab
> (line out of knucklehead> small mixer)
> (gr-1> small mixer)
> (edp's on fx sends @ small mixer)
> (small mixer out> power amp ins of 1 or 2 jc120's)
>
> this separates the tone and soundsource of the gtr from the synth and
loops
> etc; in this case, if you have (for example) a thd hotplate, you can
control
> (& balance) the overall output level of the kh w/the controls on the
hotplate
> (www.thdelectronics.com) while sending a consistent level to the
loop-dealie.
> (NB, though: using the hotplate to drive your kh cabinet at only
> 'whisper'-levels will not allow the kh speaker cab to contribute to your
> sound.....)
>
> >I'm toying with the idea of doing
> >this:
> >Guitar -> GR-1
> >GR-1 Guitar Out -> Knucklehead (preamp) -> KH Effects Loop with a few
> >goodies -> KH Effects return -> KH power amp -> KH Line Out -> GR-1
Guitar
> >Return
> okay.....
>
> >GR-1 Stereo Outs -> the rest of my stereo setup, including an EDP on 
>each
> >side, ending into two JC-120s
> sounds reasonable, but then you'll not be getting the best out of the
> knucklehead through the 'high-efficiency' jc-120's, i think.....
>
> >This will require me to have a dummy load on the Rivera.
> right; and most dummy-loads still require the amp to be connected to an
> actual speaker cab.....
>
> >1st question
> >- any
> >experience with the common dummy load devices?  Any idea which will give
> >me
> >a true dummy load, while maintaining the beautiful tone of the Rivera?
> quick answer:
> well, there's no quick answer to that.
> if you wanna maintain the sound of yer kh, yer gonna need to play it
through
> a suitable spkr cab.
> i have, myself, a few pathways to that end:
> 1) my current setup uses the thd hotplate: very good-sounding & reactive,
> very flexible w/a variety of selectable spkr-output-levels and one pure
> dummy-load,
> 2) my rivera m100 has a built-in switchable dummy-load, which does the 
>job
> well so long as the line-out eventually ends in a suitable gtr spkr-cab,
and
> 3) a switchable dummy-load w/compensated line-out made by mark bartel (of
> toneking amplifiers) that functions much like the rivera, but in a
> transportable box.
>
> i don't know if this'll help ya, but over the years i've developed this
> system as my 'direct-recording' rig:
> gtr>pedals>toneking comet 40 amp & cab>thd hotplate(set at -12dB, so
there's
> still some gtr sound in the room)>ada ampulator (reactive power tube
> tone-shaping)>small mixer (loops, fx, etc)>ada microcab2 (speaker
emulation)>
> recorder.
>
> >2nd question - do you have success with taking the Line Out from a
Rivera,
> >running it through rack gear, and going out to other guitar amp(s)?
> that has worked for me, in the past, but:
> i would think that jc120's are not gonna be the perfect match for what i
> presume is the KH's original tone.....
> but:
> experimenting is the *only* way to find out what might work for 
>***you***!
>
> >Is
> >my
> >tone gonna sound like doo-doo?  I can't really test this until I have a
> >dummy load.
> as far as i can tell, the 2 major available choices would be:
> 1) the thd hotplate (which i quite like, myself), and
> 2) the palmer stuff..... ( available at http://www.palmerdirect.com/  )
>
> hope that helps!, and sorry if it doesn't.....
> best,
> dt / splattercell
>