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mech wrote: So, to summarize, there is interesting Hip Hop being made. You just have to get out of the US to find it. ooooooh, I'm sorry but I will contend that statement with all due respect, mech: There is wonderful experimental and very innovative hip hop going on in every big city in the US these days. There are also a lot of indie underground bands who have hip hop backgrounds as kids and are doing spoken word over backing tracks that is like a more laid back version of hip hop. There are at least three groups in my small home town alone exploring this territory. Sure, it doesn't make MTV and sell millions of units and it's harder to find but go to any discerning record store that has an expert on hip hop who works there and ask he or she where the 'shit' is.....................ask specifically for experimental hip hop. you might be surprised how much underground and innovative stuff there is. You have to be hip to the whole San Francisco Anticon movement (label) at least. Ever heard ClouDdead? Check 'em out. yours Rick ps Also, and this is out of the US, but nobody seems to know about the wonderful group, originally from East Berlin before the fall of the wall, TARWATER. I love this group and they are always doing interesting experiments with hip hop and trip hop. There first three CDs are brilliant but I like everything they do. One of the members (they are a duo) is also in the wonderful German electronica band, To Roccoco Rot