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> > The other reason I think is that like a lot of people on > this list, a lot of people who do new or unusual musics are not >particularly social people to begin with but that's the subject for another > discussion. I've lived in New York City (well, across the bridge at least) and Ithaca, NY and they both had WAY better new music scenes than SF. Sorry to step on anyone's toes, but from my experiences this is what I've seen. I don't really understand why, but when I first moved out here in 1988 I struggled to find a band interested in doing something new and eventually joined a Ska band just because I wanted to play! After being in that band for a few months, I was told, "no practice next week, we'll call you and let you know when the next one is." That call never came. I later ran into the drummer who told me the original guitarest had returned to the states and they took him back. Nice. Thanks for the notice. Bitter? Sure. Shortly after, I moved to Ithaca, NY and was able to instantly find people to play with and put together a pretty kick ass band. Why? Maybe it's because people there don't have to spend 100% of their time working to pay rent? Anyway, this tiny college town had a thriving new music scene. Moved back to SF in 99. Things have changed a bit for the better for sure, but they're still not great. I've given up trying to find a co-looper or do live gigs. I've put up and answered ads to no avail. I had one response from a Looper on LD but they never returned my emails. I've done a few gigs at 29 Grand in Oakland, but it ended up just being me playing to my friends. Very nice woman named Sarah runs it though, so if you're looking for a venu I'd say start there. Mark __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com