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Thanks Scott, I definitely agree that even a simple tool is something one can learn from. I started looping with a Digitech PDS1002, then started up with the cassettes. For me, for a long time, $200 was way too much money to spend, but my cheap gear was interesting enough for me to get hooked. Re: the loop tapes, yeah, they're getting very hard to find. I bought a box of 100 answering machine tapes from Ebay for one cent in 2004, and still am using those for my static loops project (100 short loops, which I'll be releasing in a couple of months). But for my normal looping work, I splice my own tapes, using regular stock and cases. Between that and my $30 four-track, my setup is still super-budget, but still interesting to me. Daryl Shawn www.swanwelder.com www.chinapaintingmusic.com > -and for a while i was even using my old tascam 4 track (i got it free > from my friend who is a professional musician, cost me a 100$ to get > it up and running, but back in '00 couldn't get a recording device for > 100$, so i thought it was worth it) and using 20 sec loop tapes (they > are message tapes for old phone message devices), i usually was > feeding one of my delays into it, but i got some great results w/ it, > and i was even down to just 2 tracks (2 were sort of not working > great), please note that about 2 yrs ago when i was in radio shack, i > saw they had the loop tapes on clearance, so i bought a bunch, and i > haven't seen them any more when i've been in radio shacks as of late. > technology-out w/ old, in w/ new. so don't know how available they are > anymore... > -well, i think my point is, you don't have to buy some $1000 > super-gizmotron device to start exploring. >