Re: [all] stereo to mono phase problems

["Paul Buelow" <paul@webms.com>]

Wow, Excellent Lindsay. Thank you.

I will do some thorough testing now with this info. It's a very helpful at
approach to use to resolve the muddy mono monitor sound problem (thought it
doesn't affect recording or headphones).

I am using phono to RCA adapters on the control room outs which are plugged
into the TRS balanced phono outs. Aha? could be poorly wired +/- adapters.

In considering the best cable for main outs or control outs, I wonder what
type of cables to use if cabling from the balanced TRS phono outs to a
non-balanced input such as a tape deck.

non balanced cables or TRS phono balanced to non-balanced?


----- Original Message -----
From: <lindsay@pavestone.com>
To: <Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com>
Sent: Monday, November 06, 2000 12:25 PM
Subject: OT: [all] stereo to mono phase problems


>
> Hmmmm.
>
> Source material:
>    Multitrack channels:         mono
>    CD player:                   stereo
>    DJ-600 mixer:                stereo
>       (mixing stereo sources?)
>    Mic:                         mono
>
> The above are not likely to come from the source out-of-phase.  Next 
>step:
> investigate individual mixer channels.
>
> Alesis Studio 32: phase invert not available (at least I can't find it
> listed in Alesis' on-line documentation).  So rule that out.
>
> Next: cabling from mixer to amp.  Main outs are 1/4" TRS (balanced or
> unbalanced).  If I remember right, the phase-inverted signal of a 
>balanced
> output is on the ring part of the TRS cable.  I doubt that your mixer's
> wiring could be that screwed up to have the tip and ring switched on one
> output.  However, there is the slightest possibility, so try avoiding the
> main outs from your mixer--you've got control room outs as well as group
> and aux outs; mix down to a pair of those and see if you still have the
> "muddy" problem.  If so, then there's your problem--the main outs.  If
not,
> well...
>
> I doubt the problem is in the cabling itself--if it was a cabling problem
> (as in faulty cable), then you'd have the same problem all the time, not
> just when panned to center.
>
> The amp?  Man, I can't think that the amp is the problem.  But, as a 
>test,
> get some 1/4" to RCA cables and run them from your mixer's main outs and
to
> your home stereo's tape or CD in.  Listen to your mix through your 
>stereo.
> Does the problem persist?  Actually, this test would rule out everything
> downstream of your mixer: the cables, the amp, the speaker wire and the
> monitors.  Try this out.
>
> If the above test fails to reproduce the problem, then it has to be
> downstream of the mixer.  Check the polarity of all your wiring.  Make
sure
> it's consistent for both sides.  Actually, you've probably done this
> already a thousand times.  So, confident that the wiring to and from the
> amp is correct--and that the problem still persists--switch the polarity
of
> the leads coming into only one speaker.  We're now deliberately out of
> phase with the other speaker.  Still have the problem?  At this point, I
> doubt phase is the issue.  Move your speakers to a new position.  Maybe
you
> just have one wickedly bad sounding room (though this should be evident 
>in
> the stereo mixes, too).  I can't think of anything else, and I've already
> been long-winded enough.
>
>
>
>                     "Paul Buelow"
>                     <paul@webms.c        To:
<Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com>
>                     om>                  cc:
>                                          Subject:     Re: [all] stereo to
mono phase
>                     11/06/00             problems
>                     01:51 PM
>                     Please
>                     respond to
>                     Loopers-Delig
>                     ht
>
>
>
>
>
> > what is the nature of the source program material?
> >
> I've experienced the phase problem with a variety of sources and isolated
> it
> to a problem  between the mixer and the amp + speakers. The mixer is an
> Alesis32. Monitoring through the mixers headphone output does not exhibit
> the same muddy result when panning to center.
>
> I have ruled out the source as the problem. The source is fine when
patched
> directly to the amp (hence no panning to center). Is panning to center
> inherently going ot cause a phase problem. Could it be the room or 
>speaker
> position causing a problem? The source is either mono tracks from a
digital
> multitrack deck, CDs, DJ-600 mixer output or mic input.
>
> It appears to be a problem with the relationship between my cabling 
>and/or
> monitor wiring.
>
>
>