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Looper's Delight
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to this: "Your suddenly have a funk rhythm that has a completely different feel than the original rhythm." Toby Graves responded: "Yes, but that feel is gonna depend on how much it swings or how much the beat drags. Lars Ulrich could play that pattern and fit it in a Metallica song." Obviously, the feel of a rhythm can morph depending on it's use of swing; playing ahead or behind the beat, Toby. The distinction in the cased you are talking about, however, is timbral and NOT rhythmic. Looking at the history of the developement of syncopation in pop music in the United States in the 20th century, the first example I wrote came first and was associated with rhythm and blues or soul.................it has an 8th note syncopative resolution. The second example introduces an implied 16th note syncopative resolution and occurred several years after the advent of the first rhythm; first with James Browns' drummers and then later with the style that came to be known as Funk. Metallica could play the second rhythm, but it's roots would still be in Funk as a style from a rhythmic historical perspective and NOT in Rock and Roll (the genre associated with Metallica)...............the fact that they'd use liberal use of distortion and James rough vocal approach (and I dig Metallica, by the way) only changes the timbre of the piece, not the rhythm. If he were to swing it slightly (or even greatly) it would merge into hip hop as a style (and this is largely due to the fact that inexpensive drum machines used in early hip hop, had 58% swing capabilities that were used by the early producers to get a different feel. As soon as Bonham started introducing 16th note funk rhythms into hard rock with Led Zepellin or when Quiincy Jones put a rock and roll 8th note groove under MIchael Jackson's decidedly funk/r&b rhythmic approach (and then added icing to the cake by having Eddy Van Halen play a blistering heavy metal lead over the whole stew), the styles of rock, jazz, r&b, soul and funk began to merge all over popular music. Now you have heavily EBM/Industrial influenced Samba records...........they fit into the Industrial sub genre, stylistically because of the way they sound, but their historic rhythmic roots are still in Afro- Brazilian music which further illustrates my point: In repetitive 'groove' oriented syncopated rhythmic pop music, each individual rhythm has a distinct personality and affects the nervous system in a different way. Even by changing only the voices in a rhythmic arrangement (think playing Cream's 'Sunshine of Your Love" with the backbeat on the 2 and 4 ---- thank you Earl Palmer instead of the way Ginger Baker played it on the 1 and the 3) you have a distinctively different rhythm. If Metallica played both rhythms in back to back songs on the same record, the songs would each have a distinctively different feel. Does that make sense? --