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Re: difference harmonix 45000 and boomerang 3?

Hi Charles,
Yeah, I would agree that the interface seems a little criptic.
 counter intuitive. I think if it weren't for the availability of more
dedicated buttons on the sidecar I wouldn't be as interested in the

Muscle memory is all about repetition. Once I get all the bonus
buttons dialed in, I think it'l work out well.
I like the idea of start/stop for each loop on a single button, and a
bonus can be programmed to stop/start all or fade all. nce my feet
memorize where to go, it won't make any difference what the labels
say. heck, it won't make any diffeence what the labels say the second
it comes out of the box, as long as I know which button does what,
when i need it to do it. :-)

I think this will ultimately be the crux of the problem with
all-in-one floor based loopers. How many pedals can they fit on them,
and how intuitive will the functions be? There will always be
compromises, but when the user gets over the learning curve, then
things get beter.


On 12/12/13, Charles Zwicky <cazwicky@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Good luck Rusty, please let us know how you get on with the Boomerang..!
> I must say that at first glance, the user interface fills me with
> panic.. no obvious "play" "stop" or even "record" buttons.
> As a musician, but even more so as a recording engineer, I rely on
> muscular memory to perform repetitive tasks, so I am a fan of
> dedicated properly "function prioritized" physical interfaces.   The
> layout of the Boomerang breaks too many interface guidelines:
> Dissimilar functions are grouped together,  there is no
> prioritization or hierarchy of  function in the physical layout,  and
> that circle of LEDs looks like an afterthought, so many vital
> functions are required to be assigned  to "bonus" buttons.
> When I worked with Bob Sellon on the Jam Man  software, we came up
> with a MIDI map that allowed loops to be selected across the top row
> of footswitches and the bottom row had fixed, predictable assignments
> for play / mute for each loop. Once you were going you never had to
> look at anything.   I made similar suggestions for the 2880, but I
> prefer their footcontroller to my MIDI  controller, so I don't
> remember the layout...
> CZ
> At 10:18 PM -0800 12/11/13, Rusty Perez wrote:
>>Hi folks,
>>I want to second Cara's assertion that there is not a "best for blind
>>folks" anything. :-)
>>Without turning this in to a "what can blind people do?" thread, part
>>of living with any sort of disability is learning how to problem
>>solve. Some problems are worth solving, some are best avoided. So,
>>while the 45000 may require less problem solving in the sight
>>department, ultimately I think another looper may open up more
>>flexibility for this blooper.
>>And I'll throw in here that the 45000 really sounds like a GREAT
>>machine for some. And, I stand corrected. A loop artist could
>>certainly record verse on one track, chorus on a second, and
>>percussion on a third, and, as long as all of these elements are the
>>same length, could mute and unmute and loop to hisher heart's content.
>>But, i think that, for my next looper, I'll likely be choosing a
>>Boomerang which, while relying on lights to communicate settings, has
>>many customization options, particularly when the sidecar is used. So,
>>once I employ the assistance of a sighted person to configure things
>>just as i want them, I should be able to fly the rang without
>>shoegazing. :-)
>>I'll certainly let the list know how it works out for me.
>>On 12/11/13, Cara Quinn <caraquinn@caraquinn.com> wrote:
>>>  I so so so wish that there could be a pedal board version of the EDP!
>>>  Or at least a smaller version that would not need a rack.
>>>  Rather than have this turn into a 'what is my ultimate looper' thread,
>>> ;)
>>>  I'll just say that though I really find the feature sets of 'larger'
>>> loopers
>>>  way more liberating creatively, I too, very much agree that smaller /
>>>  lighter footprints are where it's at.
>>>  Smiles,
>>>  cara :)
>>>  ---
>>>  iOS design and development - LookTel.com
>>>  ---
>>>  View my Online Portfolio at:
>>>  http://www.onemodelplace.com/CaraQuinn
>>>  Follow me on Twitter!
>>>  https://twitter.com/ModelCara
>>>  On Dec 11, 2013, at 1:02 PM, Steve U <stevebassbird@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>  The LP1 does rule as far as the features, it's amazing! Like an 8 
>>> track
>>>  recording studio at your feet!  And so easy to use!!
>>>  But...the Rang III has a smaller footprint and is self contained 
>>> (unless
>>> you
>>>  get the side car).  Also, the LP1 needs a foot controller for hands
>>> free
>>>  operation increasing its size even more.  It's really nice to have 
>>> those
>>> 8
>>>  tracks and I know once you get a smaller looper the features start
>>> peeling
>>>  away.  I've pretty much exclusively used an LP1 and *LOVE* it, I 
>>> really
>>>  do-happiness shaped into a singe rack space unit.
>>>  But lately I've been thinking about downsizing (following this post 
>>> has
>>> been
>>>  awesome in helping weigh the options).  I think the Boomerang III is
>>> the
>>>  perfect balance of features and size.   I've been really wanting to 
>>> have
>>> a
>>  > loop rig that is small enough to just bring with me on any "normal"
>>>  gig/show.
>>>  I play upright, electric, & resophonic basses and play different 
>>> styles
>>> with
>>>  different folks as an accompanist and also do a solo thing too.
>>> Sometimes
>>>  I'll do a solo looping tune or two with folks I accompany and my full
>>> rig is
>>>  just a bit too big and just a little too inconvenient to always bring
>>> along.
>>>   Often I'll throw in my old RC2 to use in these situations but it's so
>>>  limiting musically it's a drag, all the while the LP1 sits at home!
>>> This
>>>  post has got me fired up, I'm going compact!!
>>>  So...does anyone want to buy my LP1!? I'll throw in the midi-buddy 
>>> foot
>>>  controller too.  I had Bob modify the midi in port to provide phantom
>>> power
>>>  to the foot controller so no wall wart needed.  It's in perfect
>>> condition,
>>>  I'd take $875 and pay for shipping as well (within reason). Contact me
>>> off
>>>  list if you're interested:
>>>  Stevebassbird@yahoo.com
>>>  Thanks all!
>>>  Steve Uccello
>>>  Www.steveuccello.com
>>>>  On Dec 11, 2013, at 11:22 AM, Andrrew Owens <rootpile@icloud.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>  Wow with these 45000 and rang comparisons, actually the LP1 DOES rule
>>>> I
>>>>  guess!!
>>>>>  On Dec 11, 2013, at 1:53 PM, Rusty Perez <rustys.lists@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>  Hi Sergio, I don't know if you have gotten a response, but I have
>>>>> been
>>>>>  thinking about this question in the past few days because I am
>>>>> looking
>>>>>  for a new looper.
>>>>>  Based on my research, I do not own either of these yet.
>>>>>  As I understand, the 2880 and 45000 have four "tracks" and a master
>>>>>  which are refered to as one "loop." These tracks are syncd together,
>>>>>  and they must all be the same length. They can play together, or
>>>>>  separately, but they CANNOT play one after the other. So, for
>>>>> example,
>>>>>  you cannot record a verse on track 1 and a chorus on track 2 and 
>>>>> then
>>>>>  play them one after the other.
>>>>>  You can do this if you use the 45000 and record one "loop" for the
>>>>>  verse--which can contain four tracks--and one loop for the
>>>>>  chorus--which contains four more tracks.
>>>>>  Then, using the foot controller, you can switch back and forth
>>>>> between
>>>>>  your first loop for the verse, and your second loop for the chorus.
>>>>>  In contrast, the boomerang III has four possible loops at the same
>>>>>  time. These loops can be played together, or one at a time one after
>>>>>  the other depending on what mode you're in on the rang. Each loop 
>>>>> can
>>>>>  contain any number of layers which are similar to the "tracks" on 
>>>>> the
>>>>>  45000. You can stack on your loops, but the individual layers cannot
>>>>>  be panned like the individual tracks can be on the 45000.
>>>>>  One advantage of the rang is that you can use the sereal sync mode
>>>>>  which allows you to have one master loop which can be played at the
>>>>>  same time as the other two or three sereal loops. This is called
>>>>>  parallel loops.
>>>>>  Depending on the mode you're set in, the rang can play parallel 
>>>>> loops
>>>>>  of different lengths and they don't have to be syncd.
>>>>>  This is, in my opinion, the most important difference between the
>>>>> rang
>>>>>  and the 45000. On the 45000 each of the 4 tracks in a "loop" must be
>>>>>  the same length. Your "loops" can be different lengths, but they
>>>>>  cannot be played at the same time or "parallel."
>>>>>  So, with the rang, you can create your master loop, maybe a
>>>>> percussion
>>>>>  track, and it will play while you switch from loop to loop to loop
>>>>>  verse, chorus, verse style.
>>>>>  Now, granted, you don't have the same flexibility of mixing your
>>>>>  various layers in one loop like you can with the 45000, but that's
>>>>> not
>>>>>  important to this loopmaker at this time. Another big difference to
>>>>>  many is tha tyou can't save loops with the rang, but this loopmaker
>>>>>  doesn't care right now.
>>>>>  :-)
>>>>>  Rusty
>>>>>>  On 5/21/13, Sergio Girardi <simpliflying@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>  Hello everybody,
>>>>>>  I was trying to sell my Boomerang 3 to a friend who is now 
>>>>>> interested
>>>>>> in
>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>  Rang3.
>>>>>>  I
>>>>>>  am pretty sure the Rang 3 is more versatile as a looper and that 
>>>>>> the
>>  >>>> 45000 cannot handle the 4 tracks in many different ways as the 
>> Rang
>> can
>>>>>>  handle its 3 or 4 separate loops.
>>>>>>  But this of the 4 tracks vs 4 loops had already confused me at the
>>>>>> times
>>>>>>  of
>>>>>>  the 2880.
>>>>>>  My friend for example insists that the 45000 has got 4 separate
>>>>>> loops.
>>>>>>  Could anybody help me in understanding the differences and
>>>>>> advantages
>>>>>>  of
>>>>>>  these two loopers?
>>>>>>  Thanks!
> --
> ...
> http://www.zmix.net
> http://albumcredits.com/zmix