Re: what a loop has to say

["Kris Hartung" <khartung@cableone.net>]

> Well Kris, that very much depends on where you draw the line of 
> musicianship, and what you consider music.

Absolutely. It's not so cut and dried, but very fuzzy...which is why this 
thread will likely go on for a long time.

If it takes ages to set up a
> randomization patch, do the scripting for the post-recording sequencing, 
> and handling the massive amounts of data that is sometimes required 
>(like 
> in a max/msp patch) is that then still not part of the musical process?

I call that craft, not art or musicianship. It's just my strong opinion on 
the subject. It is a part of the musical process, I agree, but not what I 
consider the driving force behind musical art. That transcents gear in my 
opinion. I defer to Rick's comments on musicians from other cultures. 
Whatever they have inside of them that sparks the miricle of creativity, 
we 
have too have inside, but you don't find it in 1's and 0s inside of a chip 
or processor. That's after the fact, or before the fact if you are using 
it 
to prepare for performance.

> I believe mr. LaFosse and others would make great use of that one note, 
> and even though it's just technological tom-foolery it is still highly 
> musical, and beyond the reach of your average 10-month old.

Sure, my kids can't program a unit to complete transform one basic note 
into 
an entire song, but someone else can for them. Again, what is the musician 
taking credit for? The note? The processor and engineering that transforms 
the note?  What do we mean by saying "making use of that one note?"  Who 
is 
making use if it?  These are more rhetorical questions, of course, subject 
to wildly varying, subjective, and contradictory responses!

> Most of my looping these days is based on a more-or-less random audio 
> input, that does not make it less musical, at least to my ears.
> Andreas

That's cool. I do that on occasion, using the SunRa VST plugin...I don't 
take credit for the output or consider it a facet of my artistic 
creativity. 
It's just fun to play with.

Kris

> Kris Hartung wrote:
>> [...]it is about
>> being aware of the music, but also who or what is generating the music 
>> and
>> taking responsibility for this. If I play one note and my gear 
>generates 
>> an
>> entire 5 minute song by randominzing that note, sequencing,, 
>etc...that's
>> hardly a case of me being aware of my own music. That's letting the 
>gear 
>> to
>> the work for me.  That's not even musicianship in my book. My 10 month 
>> old
>> kids can do this.  So simply being aware of the music and letting it 
>flow
>> through me is not a complete criteria as I see it....but I know what 
>you 
>> are
>> getting at here and agree with your concept. Again, there are varying
>> degrees of what we are talking about here, and all exceptions noted.
>>
>> Kris
>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>>
>
>